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Online T800XC

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TigerTool - A Diagnostic Project
« on: September 27, 2014, 09:43:52 PM »
At the start of a quiet summer work-wise for me, I picked up some very old notes from OBD work that I'd taken a look at many years ago, and so began the TigerTool project. Here's the start of some ramblings about talking to my bike (but not in some tree-hugging hippy kind of way)....

If you want to access your bike's ECU there's TuneBoy, TuneECU, Dealertool and probably others, but being the inquisitive type I wanted to know more about the processes. Aside from the aforementioned systems, anyone with a simple hardware interface and software on their PC or phone can talk to the bike to read basic data, including fault codes. Since the ECU on the Tiger isn't OBD compliant (by its own admission), the amount of data that you can read with the basic interface setup is limited. i.e. In my current list I have at least 50 known parameters that can be read from the ECU, but only 12 are available using a basic interface. The rest need access to the ECU to be unlocked - (perhaps more about security access #27 later?).

Once ECU access has been unlocked, (depending on the access level, as there are several), in addition to the various sensor parameters, you can also read the following:-
  Bike VIN number
  ECU serial number
  ECU tune number
  ECU cal number
  Last ECU tune install date
  ECU tune update count
  Original (factory) ECU install date

Most of the above details can of course be read using the freely available TuneECU software. One feature where TuneECU falls over however is the ability (or lack-of) to reset the service interval and therefore reset the 'spanner' icon. The reason for this is simple - TuneECU only has access to pin7 on the OBD connector so only ISO9141 & ISO14230 protocols are available, whereas to reset the service interval needs CAN protocol access on pins 6 & 14. You could get Dealertool to give you the reset feature, but of course you have to pay for it.

Although the above listed features need ECU security access to be unlocked, it looks like resetting the service interval has no such restriction! Anyone with a cheap basic (e.g. ELM327) reader that they bought from their favourite online auction site could reset their service interval if they knew how, something that I eluded to in another thread a little while ago. Once I've had time to play more with this and other stuff, I might post details on how it's done.


My plans with the TigerTool project were never to try to make another TuneECU or Dealertool - I just don't see the point as they're both very good and do exactly what they claim. Instead I've been playing with designs for a plug-in interface that provides ECU access in the same way as them, so you can read ECU data and/or reset the service interval if you like, but also leave the device plugged-in and configured to record a preset number of parameters that can then be downloaded and viewed on a PC. This partly came about when Greg had problems with the TPS on his bike causing it to cutout when he went off throttle. I wondered whether it would be possible to record TPS or other sensor data while it was going tits-up to see if the problem could be tracked down. I found a great little adaptor from China (and it's dirt cheap) that does the whole recording thing, but because the Tiger's ECU isn't OBD compliant you're restricted as to what it can record and you can't select the parameters to suit your application. However, what I've learned from it could help with some pointers for TigerTool. If I was more familiar with the processor on the cheap interface/recorder then I would consider writing my own firmware for it, something that I've not completely ruled out yet.

What I would also love TigerTool to be capable of, is the registering of new TPMS sensors as none of the systems out there seem to be able to do this. I'm afraid to say that so far I'm out of luck talking to the immobiliser (where the TPMS control is stored). To avoid the risk of bricking my bike, I might have to invest in a 2nd hand wiring loom, ECU & immobiliser setup, but that might be a bit costly for what is just a fun project!

Summer's over so works getting busier now. I don't know how far this will take me or how long I can spend on the project, but for anyone interested I'll try to keep updating as & when I can.






p.s. While buying & testing various interfaces for this project I came across some that could be supplied as 'Dealertool-compatible'. I've also tested them to confirm that claim!  :181:
  
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Online KildareMan

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Re: TigerTool - A Diagnostic Project
« Reply #1 on: September 27, 2014, 10:59:23 PM »
Fair play T 800XC.
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Offline Buzz

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Re: TigerTool - A Diagnostic Project
« Reply #2 on: October 01, 2014, 04:40:10 PM »
Hi, I'm after resetting my service tool whats my cheapest way of doing it?

Offline andyrut

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Re: TigerTool - A Diagnostic Project
« Reply #3 on: October 01, 2014, 06:11:53 PM »
*Originally Posted by Buzz [+]
Hi, I'm after resetting my service tool whats my cheapest way of doing it?

Currently Dealer tool matey.

Andy  :123:
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Offline Buzz

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Re: TigerTool - A Diagnostic Project
« Reply #4 on: October 01, 2014, 06:43:09 PM »
Cheers

Online T800XC

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Re: TigerTool - A Diagnostic Project
« Reply #5 on: October 01, 2014, 09:25:33 PM »
I've tested 2 different 'Dealertool compatible' interfaces recently so there may be a cheaper option if/when I finish testing some software!
  
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Online T800XC

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Re: TigerTool - A Diagnostic Project
« Reply #6 on: February 27, 2015, 10:05:18 PM »
Picking up this old topic rather than starting a new one....

Firstly, thanks to Busterdan for donating the ECU from his drowned 800XC for nothing more than the cost of postage. He also threw in the immobiliser which I'm hoping will come in handy later.

After checking the wiring on various schematics I put the ECU on my bench and wired the appropriate pins to a 12V supply and my trusty ELM/OBD interface. Then I held my breath while I turned the power supply on, and no smoke! In fact, it seems to work just perfectly so the Triumph sealing of the ECU obviously did its job while Busterdan's bike sat underwater for a week!

When I say "work perfectly", what I mean is I can talk to the ECU from my PC using TigerTool & Dealertool and I can read all of the usual data. It does have 18 fault codes stored which is to be expected as I've not connected any of the sensor inputs. I'll probably mock-up some inputs to have a play when I feel the urge, but for now I want to delve deeper into the CAN bus comms to see how the ECU talks to the immobiliser and the instrument panel. To do this I'll add a second OBD interface on the CAN bus to monitor just the CAN traffic.

What I need to do now is find a cheap instrument panel to connect to the the setup on my bench. The problem with these is their cost and too many are stolen & flogged on eBay. However, if anyone's got a damaged unit (e.g. from a crashed bike) going cheap just let me know. Failing that I might have to take the one off my 800 while it's garaged for a while. Hopefully I won't do it any harm!

  
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Online T800XC

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Re: TigerTool - A Diagnostic Project
« Reply #7 on: March 07, 2015, 10:39:24 PM »
I've still got some stuff to do to wire-up my "virtual 800" on my test bench so I decided to plug my OBD leads & laptop directly into my bike to read what's going on on the CAN bus and do a bit more tinkering this evening. A few interesting bits in there...

1/ I'm pretty sure I can see the commands that indicate the presence of the instrument assembly to the ECU. I need to disconnect the instruments and repeat the tests to confirm this. This command might be useful to know for anyone whose instruments get stolen or damaged as it should (in theory) be possible to still ride the bike if you can fake the instrument's ID on the CAN bus.

2/ I can see the command that tells the instruments to display the selected gear position and neutral light. There are also commands in there for the other instrument gauges (e.g. temperature & fuel level), but I need to confirm which is which.

3/ I can see the comms between the ECU & immobiliser when the ignition is switched on and the ignitions key's RF chip is read. At the end is a command that indicates whether the key was successfully read or not, and whether the immobilser light is displayed on the instruments. By wrapping the fob of my ignition key in foil I can block the reading and get the immobliser light to turn on.

More later....
  
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Offline Zaphod

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Re: TigerTool - A Diagnostic Project
« Reply #8 on: March 08, 2015, 12:15:57 AM »
Poxy drink and drunk posts

Hijack sorry :-)
« Last Edit: March 08, 2015, 12:33:58 AM by Zaphod »

Offline busterdan

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Re: TigerTool - A Diagnostic Project
« Reply #9 on: May 16, 2015, 11:57:49 PM »
*Originally Posted by T800XC [+]
Picking up this old topic rather than starting a new one....

Firstly, thanks to Busterdan for donating the ECU from his drowned 800XC for nothing more than the cost of postage. He also threw in the immobiliser which I'm hoping will come in handy later.

After checking the wiring on various schematics I put the ECU on my bench and wired the appropriate pins to a 12V supply and my trusty ELM/OBD interface. Then I held my breath while I turned the power supply on, and no smoke! In fact, it seems to work just perfectly so the Triumph sealing of the ECU obviously did its job while Busterdan's bike sat underwater for a week!

When I say "work perfectly", what I mean is I can talk to the ECU from my PC using TigerTool & Dealertool and I can read all of the usual data. It does have 18 fault codes stored which is to be expected as I've not connected any of the sensor inputs. I'll probably mock-up some inputs to have a play when I feel the urge, but for now I want to delve deeper into the CAN bus comms to see how the ECU talks to the immobiliser and the instrument panel. To do this I'll add a second OBD interface on the CAN bus to monitor just the CAN traffic.

What I need to do now is find a cheap instrument panel to connect to the the setup on my bench. The problem with these is their cost and too many are stolen & flogged on eBay. However, if anyone's got a damaged unit (e.g. from a crashed bike) going cheap just let me know. Failing that I might have to take the one off my 800 while it's garaged for a while. Hopefully I won't do it any harm!

Well done mate.... sounds like you've made great progress :)

 


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