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Offline mcinlb

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Re: French speeding fine question
« Reply #20 on: March 15, 2019, 08:43:48 AM »
I got the same from a German speed camera, I paid it , not worth any hassle if in France again touring and get pulled...

Offline Squirrelly

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Re: French speeding fine question
« Reply #21 on: March 15, 2019, 09:51:49 AM »
*Originally Posted by gordybrock [+]
:493: :0461:  Don't pay them sweet f * ck all

Thank you for your considered opinion  :001:

Since posing the question I've found a letter to 'Ride Magazine' with a question answered by Andrew Dalton from Dalton White Motorcycle Solicitors, their legal advice contributor.  Full question and answer below...

"I have just come back from a ten-day riding break in Spain, which I can highly recommend Malaga has some fantastic roads. But I have come home to a nasty souvenir, a 50 fine for speeding.

I have clearly been caught in a radar trap. I have heard so much conflicting information from different people that I am unsure what to do with it.

Lots of people have told me that I can simply ignore it, because the Spanish police cannot do anything within the UK jurisdiction. Other people have said pay it just to avoid any hassle and my wife is convinced that if I ever set foot in mainland Europe again I will be carted off to jail if I dont pay. Also, once we Brexit, will these fines have any impact at all? I am planning on going back to Andaiucia next year. Will Brexit make it more difficult?

Answer

Pay it! Now that I have told you to pay it, pay it as soon as practicable. You will not be locked up if you go to Spain but your wife has the right idea, albeit dramatically. It has entered biking folklore that you can simply ignore foreign tickets: you cant; or at least you cant ignore tickets issued in the European Union, while we remain in the EU.

By an EU-wide agreement a local fine, if unchallenged, becomes payable, if it isnt paid, the fine is sent on to the local agency in this case, the DVLA which will deploy its enforcement officers, who are usually Magistrates Courts Officers. The longer that you leave it, the more steps are taken end in the worst case that I have seen, a 100 fine escalated up to just shy of 1000 so pay your 50. On the positive side, no points go on your licence.

As to what happens after Brexit, I cannot tell you, A crash-out will probably mean no fines, as they are enforceable under an EU treaty. While this may sound like youll be able to tear across Europe without worrying about fines, many European police forces have the power to seize a foreign vehicle for even minor traffic infringements and without a method of enforcing fines on a UK driver, they are more likely to use that power.

If we have a Brexit with a run-off period, I would hope for at least a couple of years of things staying as they are with mutual recognition of licences and insurance and also, mutual recognition of fines. However, this is by no means certain. I really would not like to speculate how a no-deal Brexit would impact on motorcyclists traveling to the EU, but there is a pretty clear fall-back position; the 1968 Vienna Convention. Riding your own bike in Spain will certainly be possible under this, which was used before the EU and governs non-EU traffic in the EU. However, we might need separate insurance and potentially an international driving permit.

But the shape of any rules will be outside of the UK governments power if theres a crash-out Brexit; it will be up to the EU whether it accepts UK licences (it should as its currently a Euro licence); but I think insurance will require a Green Card for us in Europe (and for EU drivers coming to the UK). It will be more of a hassle to get to the EU by bike but it wont be impossible. However, Germany and Portugal are not parties to the 1968 Convention, so I would avoid travel on your own bike there until things are clearer.

If things go horribly pear-shaped, we may be required to buy local insurance on some borders. This is what happens upon entering Morocco (a member of the 1968 Convention) if you do not have pre-existing cover for Morocco but it is not terribly expensive. How good the insurance is, I have never tested. One thing to ponder; my current insurance certificate insures me right across the EU including about four months post-Brexit so I am not sure if the insurers have actually considered the impact of a crash-out, or hard, Brexit.

Andrew Dalton

RiDE Magazine November 2018"
« Last Edit: March 15, 2019, 10:09:35 AM by Squirrelly »

Offline StretchToo

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Re: French speeding fine question
« Reply #22 on: March 15, 2019, 01:56:36 PM »
Have to agree with Mr Dalton. The hassle of driving outside the EU is ridiculous. (or doing anything at - I'm currently spending days working out tariff and import regulations for selling our kit into the US, whereas selling in the EU is like selling in Yorkshire - they talk funny but you can go and do it tomorrow if you want)

The fact that they can chase us across borders is/was a minor price to pay for being able to just up and go. We may find ourselves needing 2 or 3 international driving permits and special insurance for some journeys across Europe if things go south next week - that'll cost more than the odd speeding fine.

Offline Grumps

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Re: French speeding fine question
« Reply #23 on: March 16, 2019, 01:14:54 PM »
Got my Green Cards today. One for each trip. No idea why they couldn't just issue one for the whole year though?

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Offline prenticemarie

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Re: French speeding fine question
« Reply #24 on: March 16, 2019, 01:28:55 PM »
*Originally Posted by gordybrock [+]
What happens if you just ignored it? Would they demand your extradition? Would you be sent to the guillotine? Exactly what legal jurisdiction do they have over us Brits? Do you seriously think a French trucker would pay a UK fine sent 6 months after the event? Personally, I'd let them whistle for their 45 euros.  :232:
Having spoken to the French Embassy, when I faced a similar situation and asked about not bothering to pay, I was advised that there would be a possibility that on my next visit to France records could show an unpaid fine and my bike could be impounded ! ... My advice is pay up  :031:
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Offline bucksfizz

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Re: French speeding fine question
« Reply #25 on: March 16, 2019, 02:35:11 PM »
*Originally Posted by prenticemarie [+]
Having spoken to the French Embassy, when I faced a similar situation and asked about not bothering to pay, I was advised that there would be a possibility that on my next visit to France records could show an unpaid fine and my bike could be impounded ! ... My advice is pay up  :031:

How would any immigration official know that it was you riding the bike at the time of the 'offence'?
What proof would he have?
What if you sold the bike on return, and someone else showed up in France on that bike?
Too many unknowns for Johnny Foreigner to do anything.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2019, 02:40:50 PM by bucksfizz »

Offline prenticemarie

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Re: French speeding fine question
« Reply #26 on: March 16, 2019, 02:53:51 PM »
*Originally Posted by bucksfizz [+]
How would any immigration official know that it was you riding the bike at the time of the 'offence'?
What proof would he have?
What if you sold the bike on return, and someone else showed up in France on that bike?
Too many unknowns for Johnny Foreigner to do anything.
I know what you are saying, but regardless of who owns or who is riding the Bike at the time, if they have the registration plate details on the next crossing, there could be a lot of arguing/explaining to do ...  :187:
My My, How Time Flies ... 60 Years ... From BSA DBD34 Gold Star To Tiger 800 Road ... 1959 - 2019 !

Offline V2T

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Re: French speeding fine question
« Reply #27 on: March 16, 2019, 03:17:26 PM »
You would have all the defenses youd expect to have here. But they would presumably have the right to investigate and ask questions - so, if they have DVLA records that show you were the registered keeper at the time (matching your name in your passport) and they have a record of you having entered France at the time it seems they could reasonably expect you to explain who was riding the bike when the offence was committed. A good solicitor should get you off the hook, at a price. And lots of time wasted.

Offline Grumps

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Re: French speeding fine question
« Reply #28 on: March 16, 2019, 03:34:05 PM »
For E45 it's not worth it. Pay up and avoid France in the future. I am. Too many strikes and they are so desperate for cash they are hounding us Brits right now.

German beer is better and that's where I am going this year.
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Offline nobsta

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Re: French speeding fine question
« Reply #29 on: March 16, 2019, 05:54:52 PM »
https://www.radars-auto.com/

useful site about cameras and fines in France

Search the site via google to get the option of viewing in English

 


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