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Offline K1W1

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Re: Norton buggered
« Reply #20 on: January 30, 2020, 08:28:29 PM »
*Originally Posted by healdem [+]
Mahindra are seemingly trying to resurrect BSA

Mahindra have already recently resurrected the Jawa brand in the Indian market.
As I said somewhat jokingly earlier the only people capable of resurrecting Norton to anything close to its previous status are the Bloors. They could use reworked twin engines from the Bonneville family and with essentially superficial styling and suspension mods introduce Atlas to Commando models under the Norton brand then develop things from there at relatively low cost.
If the Norton name is sold to anybody else the bikes will simply be cheap clones. Zhongshen for example may make a million bikes a year but what are those bikes? Just cheap runabouts for the Asian market with the odd export model thrown in for looks.

Offline D8ona

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Re: Norton buggered
« Reply #21 on: January 30, 2020, 09:16:33 PM »
KTM could go for it giving them a retro brand, they are lacking hipster appeal with their current range and no heritage to draw on. Failing that the name will likely go to China ala MG
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Offline K1W1

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Re: Norton buggered
« Reply #22 on: January 30, 2020, 10:33:23 PM »
*Originally Posted by D8ona [+]
KTM could go for it giving them a retro brand, they are lacking hipster appeal with their current range and no heritage to draw on. Failing that the name will likely go to China ala MG

I think KTM have gone a different route with the Husqvarna Vitpilen and Svartpilen range. Sort of post modern hipster bikes. Husky also has a  history going back to the early 1900s that includes V-Twin motorcycles that KTM could leverage if they wanted to really start a range of retro bikes.

Offline Rtwo

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Re: Norton buggered
« Reply #23 on: January 31, 2020, 09:09:56 AM »
The pensions allegations look quite serious and worrying for those affected.
Lack of regulation and oversight strikes again by the look of it
The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.
....George Orwell

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Offline prenticemarie

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Re: Norton buggered
« Reply #24 on: January 31, 2020, 12:09:57 PM »
*Originally Posted by Stevie.P [+]
Shame, the new bikes looked the part but were, IMO, far to expensive for (most) working class bikers and bulk sales. Priced more like a rich mans pose piece ...
Totally agree with Stevie. ... Norton paid too much attention to a niche market for playboys !  ... and who would want a clumsy old pushrod engine in 2020. :151:
« Last Edit: January 31, 2020, 12:11:50 PM by prenticemarie »
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Offline Tallpaul

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Re: Norton buggered
« Reply #25 on: January 31, 2020, 01:44:43 PM »
*Originally Posted by Rtwo [+]
The pensions allegations look quite serious and worrying for those affected.
Lack of regulation and oversight strikes again by the look of it

Political: I think it's time that government stopped directors accessing their worker's pension funds. I'm no leftie, but time after time, the pension funds are exposed to "devil may care" attempts at saving a failing business, usually at no cost to the management.

Offline Djairouks

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Re: Norton buggered
« Reply #26 on: January 31, 2020, 02:06:11 PM »
*Originally Posted by prenticemarie [+]
Totally agree with Stevie. ... Norton paid too much attention to a niche market for playboys !  ... and who would want a clumsy old pushrod engine in 2020. :151:

Well say that to Harley  :492:
https://www.rideapart.com/articles/368113/harley-new-pushrod-engine-patent/

Online healdem

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Re: Norton buggered
« Reply #27 on: January 31, 2020, 02:17:11 PM »
As far as I can see Norton and Garner did not do anythign with Norton pensioners, pension schemes and so on. All these reports seem to infer that Norton benefitted from people transferring cash from their pension funds into dodgy schemes. Some of the money went from these dodgy schemes went into Norton, but as ever with dodgy schems most went intot the pockets of the organisers.

Ive yet to see anything that suggests Norton under Garner was actively or knowingly acting in bad faith, beyond taking orders for bikes and not fulfilling them when they said they would.

It took Norton a long, long time to get the original launch models to the US market, where they had taken significant deposits against purchases. Some of those delays were down to engineering problems. They definitely had engine supply problems in the early 2010's, where they had built the bike without the engine and gearbox.

its still way to early for anyone to be definitive about what happened, but I suspect that if the reportsd are correct that two other Garner owned business are also going bankrupt (whether that be receivership or liquidation) then he has probbaly run out of cash and run out of assets to pledge against loans.

There were reportedly 100 employees at Norton, thats a lot of mouths to feed if you are not selling (and by definition not making) many items for sale then you are going to be hurt very quickly and very badly.  it looks like they were registering lees than a couple of thousand bikes since 2010 in the UK. Im just amazed they kept going as long as they did.



Online Paulhere

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Re: Norton buggered
« Reply #28 on: January 31, 2020, 03:42:46 PM »
Garner said they were turning out 500 bikes/year. If they sold at 20k/bike bringing in 10M gross. Wage bill for 100 bodies with on-cost must be in the region of 4M + Plant, Machinery, materials & race team cost. Hardly ticking over. Nowt left for the taxman.  :211:
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Offline Rtwo

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Re: Norton buggered
« Reply #29 on: January 31, 2020, 04:03:55 PM »
At least they saved money on the racers, McGuinness has been tweeting for the last couple of weeks that Garner has gone AWOL without paying him
The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.
....George Orwell

Check the Facts !!

 


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