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Offline boldie

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Re: ‘Tiger 850 Sport’ due next year?
« Reply #20 on: October 22, 2020, 06:28:40 PM »
I still think T plane crank for the off road version and 120 Deg crank for the roadies, where it's not required. That way there is something for most people.
 
I'd 100% be riding the 900 over the 800 if it were not for the T plane crank vibrations.

Offline Tripple3

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Re: ‘Tiger 850 Sport’ due next year?
« Reply #21 on: October 22, 2020, 06:40:57 PM »
*Originally Posted by boldie [+]
I still think T plane crank for the off road version and 120 Deg crank for the roadies, where it's not required. That way there is something for most people.
 
I'd 100% be riding the 900 over the 800 if it were not for the T plane crank vibrations.

It would seem quite a few people that would have spent there hard earned cash think the same way. If you want an engine that feels like a twin for off road fit a twin cylinder engine not a mish mash. As an engineer you always strive to reduce vibrations from engines and the stresses they bring.

Online Aussie Tiger

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Re: ‘Tiger 850 Sport’ due next year?
« Reply #22 on: October 22, 2020, 09:04:39 PM »
Part of me wants to say there’s no way I can see Triumph producing 2 versions of the same engine but then I look at the 1200 Twin engine where the Thruxton gets the Hi Power version with a lighter crankshaft and higher compression than the Hi Torque T120. I’d still be very surprised if they had T plane and 120 versions of the 900, but I guess it can’t be totally ruled out.
I feel they the few people who have a set against the T plane are firstly in a very small minority and secondly are wrong when they say it sounds and feels like a twin. It sounds and feels more like a twin than a regular triple, but it still sounds like a triple, only with character. The vibration is different but not the same as a twin and I’m finding it less annoying at high revs than the wizziness of the 800. The reality is that emission controls demand that manufacturers look for innovative ways to provide the performance riders want. IF I was wanting a purely road only bike and it had the 900 engine with all its low down torque and I was worried about the vibration, I’d just be popping a bigger front cog on. A mate if mine did it to his XCX to keep Highway revs down and it certainly made it nicer at 150km/h than mine was without.

Offline Djairouks

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Re: ‘Tiger 850 Sport’ due next year?
« Reply #23 on: October 22, 2020, 09:17:10 PM »
*Originally Posted by Aussie Tiger [+]
Part of me wants to say there’s no way I can see Triumph producing 2 versions of the same engine but then I look at the 1200 Twin engine where the Thruxton gets the Hi Power version with a lighter crankshaft and higher compression than the Hi Torque T120. I’d still be very surprised if they had T plane and 120 versions of the 900, but I guess it can’t be totally ruled out.
I feel they the few people who have a set against the T plane are firstly in a very small minority and secondly are wrong when they say it sounds and feels like a twin. It sounds and feels more like a twin than a regular triple, but it still sounds like a triple, only with character. The vibration is different but not the same as a twin and I’m finding it less annoying at high revs than the wizziness of the 800. The reality is that emission controls demand that manufacturers look for innovative ways to provide the performance riders want. IF I was wanting a purely road only bike and it had the 900 engine with all its low down torque and I was worried about the vibration, I’d just be popping a bigger front cog on. A mate if mine did it to his XCX to keep Highway revs down and it certainly made it nicer at 150km/h than mine was without.

Sorry mate but nobody is wrong here, opinions are personal things, whatever being a minority or majority, disliking the twinesque triple is not wrong, it's constructive criticism from some people.
You love it and that's great and fine too, everyone is allowed to think what they want here.

But anyway to me the sport moniker is usurped by 95hp, t crank or not, I just don't understand their logic.

You can go 150 in Australia ??? Here it's direct to jail at that speed  :033:, so it's never vibes for me.

Online Aussie Tiger

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Re: ‘Tiger 850 Sport’ due next year?
« Reply #24 on: October 23, 2020, 01:11:19 AM »
*Originally Posted by Djairouks [+]
Sorry mate but nobody is wrong here, opinions are personal things, whatever being a minority or majority, disliking the twinesque triple is not wrong, it's constructive criticism from some people.
You love it and that's great and fine too, everyone is allowed to think what they want here.

But anyway to me the sport moniker is usurped by 95hp, t crank or not, I just don't understand their logic.

You can go 150 in Australia ??? Here it's direct to jail at that speed  :033:, so it's never vibes for me.

Sorry, you misunderstood. Wasn’t saying anyone wasn’t entitled to an opinion but I can’t think of any Twin that has the feel of this T plane triple so, the corollary if that is that this triple doesn’t feel like a twin. It’s not an opinion that it has 3 cylinders; they’re there and you can feel that it’s not a twin. Anyway, I do get that some don’t like it. That’s their opinion. I’m sure that twin lovers would say it feels like a triple.

There’s probably some roads in the Northern Territory where you can still do 150 (not sure - used to be no limit) and on most other roads it is a “lose your licence” speed and even hand over the keys. I was referring to the once or twice I may have accidentally nudged that speed to get out of danger from an avalanche or something. Actually that’s a good point you raise. Most who have commented adversely on the vibration have said it’s particularly noticeable past 6,000rpm. That = 150km/h. At 100 km/h the engine’s purring along at 4,000.

Offline AvgBear

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Re: ‘Tiger 850 Sport’ due next year?
« Reply #25 on: October 23, 2020, 02:14:19 AM »
*Originally Posted by Dilbert [+]
It will be more of a roadster and may even signal the end of the 800-900 XR variants, with 17" wheels for more road friendly tyre sizing.
Oh No.., you mean no more (factory equipped) 100/90/19 bias ply front tires..?
What will we ever find to complain about..?

*Originally Posted by Dilbert [+]
The Tiger Sport was never exported into the US market
The USA got Tiger 1050s from '07 ~ (about) '09 -- but, altho they looked like "Sport", they may not have been named such?
“There are a terrible lot of lies going about the world, and the worst of it is that half of them are true.”
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Offline AvgBear

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Re: ‘Tiger 850 Sport’ due next year?
« Reply #26 on: October 23, 2020, 02:20:28 AM »
*Originally Posted by Tripple3 [+]
As an engineer you always strive to reduce vibrations from engines and the stresses they bring.
Well, maybe not always?: the latest Harley big-twins are "balanced" -- but the engineers stopped short of "smooth".
They actually backed-off from smooth and maintained the amount of vibration test-riders preferred.
“There are a terrible lot of lies going about the world, and the worst of it is that half of them are true.”
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Offline julianhj

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Re: ‘Tiger 850 Sport’ due next year?
« Reply #27 on: October 23, 2020, 07:21:03 AM »
Here’s Bennett’s take on the naming strategy, which echoes what I suspected:

https://www.bennetts.co.uk/bikesocial/news-and-views/news/2020/october/triumph-tiger-850-sport-for-2021

As for discussion on engines, I’m confident there will be few changes, if any, from the 900.

Offline Djairouks

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Re: ‘Tiger 850 Sport’ due next year?
« Reply #28 on: October 23, 2020, 07:41:28 AM »
*Originally Posted by AvgBear [+]
Well, maybe not always?: the latest Harley big-twins are "balanced" -- but the engineers stopped short of "smooth".
They actually backed-off from smooth and maintained the amount of vibration test-riders preferred.

HD now are hardly selling bikes, their demographic is soon gone as they don't adapt to the "real world" because they want to stay "heritage", so not the best comparison Triumph definitely didn't stay full heritage with Bonnies and scramblers, which is exactly why HD is slowly dying and Triumph isn't.

In Switzerland since second or third year the 1050 was named tiger sport, I contemplated getting one many times, but it was too damn heavy in my opinion.

So then this will be in the cheaper Triumph line, not sure what to think about this, I find it just weird doing this as a pure road bike, not reworking the engine mapping to shoot for horsepower, because then the only incentive between that and a GT will be how cheaper it is, why have the different trims of equipment on the 900 then, it kind of makes it redundant, unless it's so cheap that one could ask themselves if it's not detrimental to the Triumph brand image.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2020, 07:54:59 AM by Djairouks »

Online Derchef1962

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Re: ‘Tiger 850 Sport’ due next year?
« Reply #29 on: October 23, 2020, 09:47:33 AM »
I almost sure we will not see a change in the 900cc engine regarding the T plane crank unless it fails completely in the market which I currently do not see. They will use this engine in different frames and with different wheels but the engine is to stay at least mid-term. I remember talking to mechanice outside the Hinckley factory and he said, that Triumph is "a small bug in the industry compared to BMW and the Japanese". He did not mention HD by the way.....

Therefore, he said Triumph is concentrating on what they are good at and make the maximum out of it. So they stopped doing the Daytona, stoppend doing touring bikes like the Sprint, the Commander had to go etc. It's naked bikes, the classic retros, adventure bikes (with the Rocket being an exception). Bearing that in mind it's simply too expensive to have a diferent engine just for one bike.

Do not get me wrong I love the smooth Tiger 800 which is an almost perfect concept for me. On the other hand the test ride I had on the GT pro was super and if my beloved Tiger 800 dies tomorrow I'd at the dealer the next day to buy a GT Pro.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2020, 09:50:34 AM by Derchef1962 »
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