Author [NL] [FR] [ES] [DE] [SE] [IT] Re Tools for Cam Timing.  (Read 1567 times)

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  • Offline Stevie.P   gb

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    Re: Re Tools for Cam Timing.
    Reply #10 on: Jan 23, 2022, 12.48 pm
    Jan 23, 2022, 12.48 pm
    *Originally Posted by awjdthumper [+]
    ... simply checking the valve timing is within a reasonable tolerance (eg a 1-2 degrees), you need a corresponding slightly less tight fit with the tool - otherwise, if the timing is not perfect, the tool will not fit!

    So your logic appears to be possibly, if required, have 2 tools, one for checking 'nearly right' and then make/buy the right size one for correcting if you decide it's worse than 'nearly right'. :027:

    The correct size either fits so timing correct, or it doesn't and timing needs correcting ... for me I'll only be doing this every 24k not 12k as per the service schedule (might be different if I had a garage or covered facility) so I have opted for spot on (plus as previously shown picture mine was considerably out) ... but everyone to their own choice obviously. :002:
    Also owned my 1979 Bonnie T140E from new!
    We don't stop playing because we grow old .. WE GROW OLD BECAUSE WE STOP PLAYING!!!


  • Offline Stevie.P   gb

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    Re: Re Tools for Cam Timing.
    Reply #11 on: Jan 23, 2022, 12.51 pm
    Jan 23, 2022, 12.51 pm
    These are what I used.


    Crankshaft locking pin. I would just be a bit cautious with a drill bit not to forget and accidently try to rotate the crankshaft with one fitted because as most of us know drill bits can be brittle and break relatively easy with the wrong forces applied.


    The official tool looks (to me) to have possibly had the bar surface hardened and surface ground to correct size?


    The cam chain tensioner is in a really awkward position with regards to getting straight access onto the screw for torqueing as the frame is in the way, probably how Triumph justify their horrendous price for their tool. I got my line of drive as straight as possibly with a 1/4" drive U/J and some 1/4" drive extensions.




    Also owned my 1979 Bonnie T140E from new!
    We don't stop playing because we grow old .. WE GROW OLD BECAUSE WE STOP PLAYING!!!


  • Offline awjdthumper   gb

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    Re: Re Tools for Cam Timing.
    Reply #12 on: Jan 23, 2022, 01.38 pm
    Jan 23, 2022, 01.38 pm
    *Originally Posted by Stevie.P [+]
    So your logic appears to be possibly, if required, have 2 tools, one for checking 'nearly right' and then make/buy the right size one for correcting if you decide it's worse than 'nearly right'. :027:

    The correct size either fits so timing correct, or it doesn't and timing needs correcting ... for me I'll only be doing this every 24k not 12k as per the service schedule (might be different if I had a garage or covered facility) so I have opted for spot on (plus as previously shown picture mine was considerably out) ... but everyone to their own choice obviously. :002:
    I think the point I was making was that the Triumph tool is designed for resetting the valve timing precisely. In my case, I was only after checking that it was within a reasonable tolerance of the correct valve (< 1 deg) and, had I used the Triumph tool, it would almost certainly not have fitted and forced me unnecessarily to reset the valve timing.

    Suzuki GSX1400, Armstrong MT500 + collection of classic British bikes

  • Offline Thripster   gb

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    Re: Re Tools for Cam Timing.
    Reply #13 on: Jan 23, 2022, 04.10 pm
    Jan 23, 2022, 04.10 pm



    Sorry folks, Stevie P is quite right the pin is 6mm (shows 5.8mm on my two verniers) and the can alignment tool 7mm or thereabouts. Apologies for misleading.

    Regards

  • Offline Stevie.P   gb

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    Offline Stevie.P

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    Re: Re Tools for Cam Timing.
    Reply #14 on: Jan 23, 2022, 04.42 pm
    Jan 23, 2022, 04.42 pm
    *Originally Posted by Thripster [+]
    .. the pin is 6mm (shows 5.8mm on my two verniers) and the can alignment tool 7mm or thereabouts. Apologies for misleading.

    As I pointed out in these sort of measurements topics we are at the mercy of our measuring equipment and all make mistakes, especially when stating from memory and I expect 99.9% of us have cheap'ish but adequate stuff in the tools department. I listed 7.04mm for the camshaft locking bar to match up with my picture but actually the other side measured out on my Vernier as 7.03mm, so safely probably a DIY makers target of 7.00mm .... readers should appreciate manufacturing tolerances and not take any given measurements as exact gospel (even official manuals get it wrong as we know).

    Similarly to the terms like 'tight fit'. I used this regarding the camshaft locking tool but in retrospect would have been better saying a 'snug sliding fit' .... but again, like using feeler gauges on valve clearances, one persons 'spot on' is another persons 'slack' or even another persons 'tight'  :027: ... and you haven't tried valve clearance adjustment until you've done a set on a running engine.:005: :034:

    To me even the fit of the Triumph crankshaft pin isn't perfect. It is nice and tight into the crankshaft pinion itself but isn't equally tight in the engine casting hole. To be perfect it would probably have needed to be stepped out to something like 6.1 or 6.2mm for that hole.

    Also owned my 1979 Bonnie T140E from new!
    We don't stop playing because we grow old .. WE GROW OLD BECAUSE WE STOP PLAYING!!!


  • Offline grizzlybear   gb

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    Offline grizzlybear

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    Re: Re Tools for Cam Timing.
    Reply #15 on: Jan 24, 2022, 03.47 pm
    Jan 24, 2022, 03.47 pm
    Nice tech info guys, but it easier to let Muddysump do it :087: :087: :001:

    Safe Riding :028:
    Safe Riding
    Dave( Grizzlybear) honda 125T,  Z650C2, GPZ750, GTR1000, VX800, VN1500 ,2013 tiger800,2018 Tiger800Xr, CG125 and loads of C90`s  :)

  • Offline Newhorizons   au

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    Re: Re Tools for Cam Timing.
    Reply #16 on: Jan 25, 2022, 11.31 pm
    Jan 25, 2022, 11.31 pm
    Well that makes you one lucky grizzly, would gladly use him but pretty sure he doesn't make service calls in Australia. Likely you could get him to do the service for the cost of the parts. Good deal.

    Thanks for the Part numbers Stevie, will go to my dealer and price everything. Will be interesting to see what the Aussie Dollar reflects in parts pricing, eg similar dollar to the pound or double,  like the exchange rate. We are only around .53 to the pound.

  • Offline grizzlybear   gb

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    Offline grizzlybear

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    Re: Re Tools for Cam Timing.
    Reply #17 on: Jan 26, 2022, 10.49 am
    Jan 26, 2022, 10.49 am
    I must say that we are blessed with the great Muddysump in the UK :020:

    I do most servicing myself , but don't do the valve clearances , I have done shims in the past to my Kwacks but not confident anymore, must be an age thing  :027:
    Safe Riding
    Dave( Grizzlybear) honda 125T,  Z650C2, GPZ750, GTR1000, VX800, VN1500 ,2013 tiger800,2018 Tiger800Xr, CG125 and loads of C90`s  :)

  • Offline Newhorizons   au

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    Re: Re Tools for Cam Timing.
    Reply #18 on: Jan 26, 2022, 09.21 pm
    Jan 26, 2022, 09.21 pm
    Blessed, looks more like you are too busy maintaining or riding all those bikes?

    I find 2 enough, but then you share the wear so servicing reflects time rather than mileage? More oil, less tyres.

    Fortunately my Bandit was set up way back when that was my only bike which gives me the luxury to play with the Tiger and not miss  weekly rides. Most of our ride Group have at least 2 bikes but not in your league of 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9, plus CT's  :005:

  • Offline grizzlybear   gb

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    Re: Re Tools for Cam Timing.
    Reply #19 on: Jan 27, 2022, 09.14 am
    Jan 27, 2022, 09.14 am
    I must change my signature, they are bikes I have owned :001:
    I only have the Tiger 800Xr and A Honda Cg125 for work
    Safe Riding
    Dave( Grizzlybear) honda 125T,  Z650C2, GPZ750, GTR1000, VX800, VN1500 ,2013 tiger800,2018 Tiger800Xr, CG125 and loads of C90`s  :)

     


    winded-staunch