Author [NL] [FR] [ES] [DE] [SE] [IT] Newbie revs when changing, clutchless shifts  (Read 1440 times)

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  • Offline Pluto   gb

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    Newbie revs when changing, clutchless shifts
    on: Jun 28, 2022, 07.53 am
    Jun 28, 2022, 07.53 am
    OK I've got a 2016 800 XRX I've always (I'm only 6 weeks in!) Blipped the throttle before shifting.

    What's happening is the revs go up too far just before/then during the first part of the change. If that makes sense?

    Could it have a auto blipper?

    Also shifting up whilst accelerating I can get away without using the clutch, on this particular bike can it harm the engine?

  • Online Wullie   gb

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    Re: Newbie revs when changing, clutchless shifts
    Reply #1 on: Jun 28, 2022, 12.26 pm
    Jun 28, 2022, 12.26 pm
    Hello Pluto

    Iím not quite sure what you mean in the first part of your post but regarding clutchless shifting I do it all the time. I would say about 90% of my upshifts are without the clutch and as far as I am aware it has done no harm to the bike at all (20k miles).
    I sometimes downshift without the clutch too but not so regularly. If you donít get it spot on I feel there could be extra strain on the final drive bearings and chain.
    The gearbox on these bikes (and Triumphs generally) is so good Iím not sure if the quickshifter on the new 900s is even necessary but Iím sure someone will put me right about that!
    Enjoy the bike.
    Alex   :305:

  • Offline awjdthumper   gb

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    Re: Newbie revs when changing, clutchless shifts
    Reply #2 on: Jun 28, 2022, 05.09 pm
    Jun 28, 2022, 05.09 pm
    The drive-by-wire throttle can be a bit sensitive especially compared with old fashioned cable operated throttles and can take a bit of getting used to. Despite having my XCA for 2 years, I still find throttle control a bit challenging when pulling away and, when changing down, it is probably easy to over-rev.

    In terms of clutch-less gear changing, up-shifting is always easier on the gearbox because, with the throttle slightly closed, the engine and gearbox input shaft naturally tends to slow down as you pull it out of the lower gear allowing it to more easily match the lower speed required for the higher gear.

    The problem with clutch-less down shifts is that you ideally need to blip the throttle halfway through the gear change. This can be done electronically with the Triumph Shift Assist fitted to the top of the range Tiger 900 but is not possible to do it manually. If you attempt a clutch-less downshift, it will invariably result in a significant mechanical shock which over time could wear out or damage the dog clutches in the gearbox.
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  • Offline K1W1   au

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    Re: Newbie revs when changing, clutchless shifts
    Reply #3 on: Jun 28, 2022, 10.34 pm
    Jun 28, 2022, 10.34 pm
    *Originally Posted by Wullie [+]

    The gearbox on these bikes (and Triumphs generally) is so good Iím not sure if the quickshifter on the new 900s is even necessary but Iím sure someone will put me right about that!


    Really? Then why is this forum and other Triumph forums littered with posts about gearbox problems?
    There is no way I would regularly change up or down on a 800 Tiger without using the clutch. Itís there for a reason not because it looked good on a spec sheet.

  • Online Wullie   gb

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    Re: Newbie revs when changing, clutchless shifts
    Reply #4 on: Jun 29, 2022, 12.01 am
    Jun 29, 2022, 12.01 am
    The only gear box problem I can recall cropping up here is the well known return spring linkage issue on the early models which was sorted by Triumph. I canít speak for other forums as I havenít visited them but the word on the streets has always been about the strength and ease of use of Triumph Ďboxes.
    As for the clutch, I find it useful for starting and stopping.  :038:
    Alex    :305:

  • Offline awjdthumper   gb

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    Re: Newbie revs when changing, clutchless shifts
    Reply #5 on: Jun 29, 2022, 06.49 am
    Jun 29, 2022, 06.49 am
    Triumph gearboxes may be strong but regular clutch-less gear shifts will invariably take their toll on the gearbox dog clutches over time until they get to the point where the gearbox starts to jump out of gear under load. It may not happen after 20k miles but it could happen after 40k miles. I don't mind doing the odd clutch-less upshift but you can tell from the noise it makes that most clutch-less downshifts aren't good for the gearbox :084:
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  • Offline Paulhere   gb

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    Re: Newbie revs when changing, clutchless shifts
    Reply #6 on: Jun 29, 2022, 10.04 am
    Jun 29, 2022, 10.04 am
    *Originally Posted by K1W1 [+]
    Really? Then why is this forum and other Triumph forums littered with posts about gearbox problems?
    There is no way I would regularly change up or down on a 800 Tiger without using the clutch. Itís there for a reason not because it looked good on a spec sheet.

    Yes, I've read plenty on here about gearbox failures, a spring breaks & a pin that needs a weld, even on more recent bikes & regular posters. The 800 gearbox is the smoothest, gear change of all my trumpies but also the one I treat gently. The 1050 box is super tough but clunks like an old Burman box. Don't recall early T3 boxes being a problem.
    Current bikes Tiger800 XRx, Tiger Sport 1050, Ariel FH 650, Yam Serow 225.

  • Online Stevie.P   gb

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    Re: Newbie revs when changing, clutchless shifts
    Reply #7 on: Jun 29, 2022, 11.45 am
    Jun 29, 2022, 11.45 am
     :005: ... if I was a newbie here reading this some would almost have me believing the T800 gearbox is a timebomb waiting to explode. The reality, in my 7yrs here, is yes there has been maybe 1 or 2 GEAR CHANGE MECHANISM (separate from gearbox IMO) spring or spring pin failures per year and mainly 'Gen 1' bikes, hardly a forum littered with gearbox problems. I don't recall any actual 'gearbox' related failures. :027:

    I (admittedly rarely) occasionally change gear clutch less, up and down, depending on the riding style of the day. Downchanging timed correctly can be done just as smoothly as unchanging. The first Army lorries I learnt to drive didn't have fully syncromesh gearboxes (Bedford RL 3ton) so I learnt how to double de-clutch which similarly required a 'feel' for the right time.

    For me the gearbox is great, shame I can't say the same praise for the heavy clutch operation. Heavy traffic town driving and stop start soon takes its toll being far heavier than the light hydraulic clutch on my old 1979  Bonneville T140.
    Also owned my 1979 Bonnie T140E from new!
    We don't stop playing because we grow old .. WE GROW OLD BECAUSE WE STOP PLAYING!!!


  • Offline Paulhere   gb

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    Re: Newbie revs when changing, clutchless shifts
    Reply #8 on: Jun 29, 2022, 12.33 pm
    Jun 29, 2022, 12.33 pm
    Putting gearbox into the search function, throws up an awful lot of issues.
    Current bikes Tiger800 XRx, Tiger Sport 1050, Ariel FH 650, Yam Serow 225.

  • Online JonesTheBass   gb

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    Re: Newbie revs when changing, clutchless shifts
    Reply #9 on: Jun 29, 2022, 01.39 pm
    Jun 29, 2022, 01.39 pm
    Clutch for 1>2, generally 2>3... 3>4>5>6 no clutch.
    6>5>4>3>2>1 clutch every time but blip as well.
    Done this on every bike I've had.. no gearbox problems