Triumph Tiger 800 Forum

New Members => New Members => Topic started by: Gary Leach on October 15, 2019, 07:52:02 PM

Title: Centre stand
Post by: Gary Leach on October 15, 2019, 07:52:02 PM
Hi All , Just bought a 2011 Tiger 800 ,which has been lowered by lowering Link ,Question is can I fit a centre stand. ?   :033:’
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: Mav on October 15, 2019, 10:21:41 PM
Do you need it lowered?

The tiger is a b***d to put on a centre stand anyway, lowered it will be a cow!
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: Djairouks on October 16, 2019, 07:13:01 AM
*Originally Posted by Mav [+]
Do you need it lowered?

The tiger is a b***d to put on a centre stand anyway, lowered it will be a cow!

Weird my 2018 is easy to get on the center stand, for my 74kg, I can even do with the aluminum panniers on, effortlessly, did they change the parts after 2011 ? You should go try my last bike Honda AT, if you think this one is difficult, I guess you won't manage the Honda, freaking heavy.
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: Lopez on October 16, 2019, 07:41:20 AM
*Originally Posted by Djairouks [+]
Weird my 2018 is easy to get on the center stand, for my 74kg, I can even do with the aluminum panniers on, effortlessly, did they change the parts after 2011 ? You should go try my last bike Honda AT, if you think this one is difficult, I guess you won't manage the Honda, freaking heavy.

 :0461:

My 2016 Explorer was impossible to get in cneter stand. But 2018 800 is sooo eaaasy... I love it.
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: Djairouks on October 16, 2019, 07:52:56 AM
*Originally Posted by Lopez [+]
:0461:

My 2016 Explorer was impossible to get in cneter stand. But 2018 800 is sooo eaaasy... I love it.

It's not rocket science if you can manage a 213Kg bike like the tiger 800, my AT with luggage, center stand and protection bars was 251Kg, impossible for me to lift these 38 more Kg, even with high rear preload to raise it and make it easier, seems the Explorer is as beefy that's why I didn't buy one  :008: !

That's when you need a bag of sand, heh I mean wife, to help you with this  :038:
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: Paulhere on October 16, 2019, 08:02:13 AM
And yet, the Tiger sport at 235kg is much easier to pop on the centre stand than the T800. All depends where the weight is. The T800 is very balanced on the C/S, the TS is front biased so we don't lift the same weight. Dunno about the Tex, never seen anyone use the C/S.
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: Lopez on October 16, 2019, 09:31:27 AM
*Originally Posted by Djairouks [+]
It's not rocket science if you can manage a 213Kg bike like the tiger 800, my AT with luggage, center stand and protection bars was 251Kg, impossible for me to lift these 38 more Kg, even with high rear preload to raise it and make it easier, seems the Explorer is as beefy that's why I didn't buy one  :008: !

That's when you need a bag of sand, heh I mean wife, to help you with this  :038:

It's not only the weight. I can put a BMW GS 1200 easily. It's due to a poor design/weight balance.
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: Djairouks on October 16, 2019, 09:39:30 AM
*Originally Posted by Lopez [+]
It's not only the weight. I can put a BMW GS 1200 easily. It's due to a poor design/weight balance.

Can be design sure, with luggage for exemple, using my right foot on the stand, on my Honda I couldn't reach it without having hip against the pannier which is pretty dumb, the Tiger is definitely not that bad with or without luggage.

I think if you're around 74Kg like me, it's more a matter of technique, to put bikes on the side stand, for heavier guys around 100, leverage weight is much better.
So you have to put all your weight standing on the center stand 2 legs in the air, while lifting with right arm and pulling back with left arm, I think many people are afraid it would drop and don't put all their weight.
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: Paulhere on October 16, 2019, 09:57:50 AM
There lies a lesson in using a centre stand  :047:

It's feckall to do with the weight, all down to design of the stand & position in relation to the weight & height of lift. Some very heavy bikes easy to pop on the stand. Feckall to do with rocket science shoite either.
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: Djairouks on October 16, 2019, 10:03:00 AM
*Originally Posted by Paulhere [+]
There lies a lesson in using a centre stand  :047:

It's feckall to do with the weight, all down to design of the stand & position in relation to the weight & height of lift. Some very heavy bikes easy to pop on the stand. Feckall to do with rocket science shoite either.

Sorry while there's part design between models of course, between me 74Kg and my mechanic a tall 120ish Kg guy, I need to pull up slightly to put it on center stand, while he just stands on the stand barely touching rear grab handles and it goes, so in our Tiger case yes weight will do a difference and being tall give your arm more leverage with your core.

As said lighter and smaller people need to use all their weight for a proper technique !
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: Mav on October 16, 2019, 10:59:11 AM
*Originally Posted by Djairouks [+]
Sorry while there's part design between models of course, between me 74Kg and my mechanic a tall 120ish Kg guy, I need to pull up slightly to put it on center stand, while he just stands on the stand barely touching rear grab handles and it goes, so in our Tiger case yes weight will do a difference and being tall give your arm more leverage with your core.

As said lighter and smaller people need to use all their weight for a proper technique !
You obviously haven't read all the numerous post on this forum about the T800 stand, many owners say how difficult it is to put the T800 onto its centre stand!

As Paulhere said, it’s the design and position of the stand on the 800 that is the problem.
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: Djairouks on October 16, 2019, 11:30:57 AM
*Originally Posted by Mav [+]
You obviously haven't read all the numerous post on this forum about the T800 stand, many owners say how difficult it is to put the T800 onto its centre stand!

As Paulhere said, it’s the design and position of the stand on the 800 that is the problem.

You're missing the point, it will be easier for someone depending the height of handlebar/rear handles, placement of the stand, but that's not all due to good/bad design, it's dependant on the person morphology in regards to the motorcycle design. So just saying bad bike design okay... with my flimsy 74Kg as you suggest, that all other posts here point to a bad design only, then I should also have these issues, but I don't.

With lowered Tiger as the OP, it's not normal geometry and it will be more difficult, to put on the center stand, again not bad design, just smaller rider as I said before.

Besides do you think people like me having an easy time, will make a post, to point out "ohhh the center stand is so great", not really so of course many posts of people having issue with it will be readable, doesn't prove much either does it.

I have a friend that's 150Kg and almost 2m, we once talked about this and there is no motorcycle he can't put on a center stand, he looked at me weird when I said the Honda was really difficult, he put it on like it was nothing, so motorcycle designs are one thing, but then for some people it doesn't matter, that was the point.

I'll repeat again, put all weight on the stand righ foot on it you can even bend legs and torso, then straighten suddently banging on the stand with all your weight, while pulling with arms and it will go much easier, a bit like going upstair if you will, I learned that on my difficult Honda instead of just saying bad design, this isn't helping the people asking for help !
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: Paulhere on October 16, 2019, 04:07:15 PM
I wonder, are they all the same?

With your bike on its centre stand, what is the measurement under the rear wheel to floor?


You must appreciate that most of the regular boys on here have been riding for decades. So grannies & eggs talk is not called for.
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: Djairouks on October 16, 2019, 05:43:41 PM
*Originally Posted by Paulhere [+]
I wonder, are they all the same?

With your bike on its centre stand, what is the measurement under the rear wheel to floor?


You must appreciate that most of the regular boys on here have been riding for decades. So grannies & eggs talk is not called for.

Mine on the stand is 3cm from the pavement, but more important the side stand contacter for reference, is at 25 cm on the stand and then both wheels down motorcycle straight (21 clicks preload), it measures 20cm, so if a Tiger low is 4cm lower front and 2cm rear then, it means the side stand must be different, because I Don't see how it would work to move the bike up  around 8cm rather than 5cm, with the same stand if not Triumph are dumbasses.

What I appreciate is any logical and pragmatic assesment of mecanics and systems yes, what I Don't appreciate is just saying because more people say it's bad and are older and riding more than me as you assume, with no more argument whatsoever, not talking height or weight of each individuals, that your point is better or more right… Age and number trumps logic, you managed to make me  :492: laugh really hard at least !

Not here to pick a fight mate, but I'm no Brit so your slang is completely lost on me sorry !
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: Paulhere on October 16, 2019, 06:28:39 PM
I just asked for that 3cm dim, not all the lip, thankyou.

I now see why yours is so easy to pop on the stand, my rear wheel with bike on stand is 6cm's off the ground, hence requires a good pull.

My Tiger Sport rear tyre is 3cm's off the ground & easy to pop on the stand.

Pick a fight? I was trying to make the point that most of us are not young enough to know everything.  :492:

Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: Djairouks on October 16, 2019, 06:36:41 PM
*Originally Posted by Paulhere [+]
I just asked for that 3cm dim, not all the lip, thankyou.

I now see why yours is so easy to pop on the stand, my rear wheel with bike on stand is 6cm's off the ground, hence requires a good pull.

My Tiger Sport rear tyre is 3cm's off the ground & easy to pop on the stand.

So the models are different, that's interesting and furthers my point even if you Don't want to admit it, the bike as is my 2018 is perfectly designed Nothing wrong, then you can't just generalize that all are badly designed.
This will be helpfull for people knowing 2018 apparently are easier to put on the center stand, it is relevant information !

So now would be interesting Gary measures his !? But I was thinking using just a 2cm plank and roll the rear tire on it, would help with this issue.
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: geordielad on October 18, 2019, 10:57:27 AM
*Originally Posted by Lopez [+]
It's not only the weight. I can put a BMW GS 1200 easily. It's due to a poor design/weight balance.

Have to agree - I've come from RT's (275 kg) and they were much easier to put onto and take off the centre stand.
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: Djairouks on October 18, 2019, 11:35:05 AM
*Originally Posted by geordielad [+]
Have to agree - I've come from RT's (275 kg) and they were much easier to put onto and take off the centre stand.

I also think many people have no clue about dead travel of the rear shock, I did measure SAG and it was 2cm too long with no preload, so again it's easy to say a motorcycle is badly designed, opposed to BMW Paralever, but when I then adjusted for correct sag the motorcycle sat higher, it made a difference for the center stand, even if I didn't find it difficult to begin with.
Being 74Kg and having 2cm more of SAG, I'm pretty positive most males here are hardly lighter than I am, so maybe check your SAG.

Here are all parameters of a easy/hard stand :

- Bike weight
- Placement of stand
- Placement of handles
- Length/angle of stand
- Rear suspension height
- Rider weight
- Rider arms length and height

So you can compare motorcycles yes but then maybe your morphology is an advantage or inconveniant, you have to produce for a broad range of people, which makes it as relevant as bike design in such case.
I also really don't understand dealerships don't tell you about this, explain the concept of SAG or even set it for your weight !

BTW the dealership showed me an easy way to get it off the stand, you just bang the rear tire on pavement, either same hand placement as going on stand, or just by holding handlebar normally and pulling, then it rebounds on the tire/susp as you then push slightly, easily goes down !
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: geordielad on October 18, 2019, 03:20:58 PM
*Originally Posted by Djairouks [+]
I also think many people have no clue about dead travel of the rear shock, I did measure SAG and it was 2cm too long with no preload, so again it's easy to say a motorcycle is badly designed, opposed to BMW Paralever, but when I then adjusted for correct sag the motorcycle sat higher, it made a difference for the center stand, even if I didn't find it difficult to begin with.
Being 74Kg and having 2cm more of SAG, I'm pretty positive most males here are hardly lighter than I am, so maybe check your SAG.

Here are all parameters of a easy/hard stand :

- Bike weight
- Placement of stand
- Placement of handles
- Length/angle of stand
- Rear suspension height
- Rider weight
- Rider arms length and height

So you can compare motorcycles yes but then maybe your morphology is an advantage or inconveniant, you have to produce for a broad range of people, which makes it as relevant as bike design in such case.
I also really don't understand dealerships don't tell you about this, explain the concept of SAG or even set it for your weight !

BTW the dealership showed me an easy way to get it off the stand, you just bang the rear tire on pavement, either same hand placement as going on stand, or just by holding handlebar normally and pulling, then it rebounds on the tire/susp as you then push slightly, easily goes down !

All well and good, but as far as I'm concerned, your morphology goes out of the window when you have a general concensus on the mechanical aspects of the bike in question.
As my morphology doesn't change a great deal, it is therefore a major factor in my choice of bike - weight, seat height etc. If I was a lot taller, I probably would not have chosen the Tiger, but as I'm a short 4rse, I did, because I can manage it and feel confident on it, as I did with the RT.
However, the RT is 60 odd kg heavier and still went onto and off the stand much easier than the Tiger.
I too have set up my suspension to suit my physical needs, weight and riding style.
Ergo, I believe that the majority of difficulties encountered in using the sidestand are mainly due to the design of the bike.
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: Djairouks on October 18, 2019, 06:03:13 PM
*Originally Posted by geordielad [+]
All well and good, but as far as I'm concerned, your morphology goes out of the window when you have a general concensus on the mechanical aspects of the bike in question.
As my morphology doesn't change a great deal, it is therefore a major factor in my choice of bike - weight, seat height etc. If I was a lot taller, I probably would not have chosen the Tiger, but as I'm a short 4rse, I did, because I can manage it and feel confident on it, as I did with the RT.
However, the RT is 60 odd kg heavier and still went onto and off the stand much easier than the Tiger.
I too have set up my suspension to suit my physical needs, weight and riding style.
Ergo, I believe that the majority of difficulties encountered in using the sidestand are mainly due to the design of the bike.

Again flawed logic, because many people complain doesn't mean that all these people have vastly different morphologies, what if all of them were on the lighter and shorter side, as you say tiger is more accessible, so could be, but it will be easier for heavier/taller people to put on stand. Physics can't be beaten, this very thread is on a xrx low, ergo a short rider !

So morphology doesn't necessarily go out the window, honestly I would be amused to have people give their weight and size, because to my 74kg, okay 82kg (my boots weigh 3kg  :161:) with gear and my 1m83 it's no biggie and I'm no muscle man either.

Not saying the tiger might be the best for center stand, but sorry my scientist brain likes factual measured points, not concluding just because of the masses saying one thing.

As I said if really we would see a trend, that's something to say to Future riders, which is useful.
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: applecorp on October 18, 2019, 09:40:18 PM
Before buying my XRT I saw a few reviews on YouTube where they really struggled to get the bike on the centre stand. I just dismissed them as being inexperienced or something,

Never had problems with previous bikes getting on their centre stand, FZ1, Tracer 900. Tried putting my XRT on the centre stand for the first time the other day (had the bike 3 months) when filling up with fuel and gave up after a few attempts. It's like this bike has a unique technique required compared to all other bikes, or maybe it's just really badly designed. I suspect the latter.
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: Djairouks on October 18, 2019, 09:51:09 PM
*Originally Posted by applecorp [+]
Before buying my XRT I saw a few reviews on YouTube where they really struggled to get the bike on the centre stand. I just dismissed them as being inexperienced or something,

Never had problems with previous bikes getting on their centre stand, FZ1, Tracer 900. Tried putting my XRT on the centre stand for the first time the other day (had the bike 3 months) when filling up with fuel and gave up after a few attempts. It's like this bike has a unique technique required compared to all other bikes, or maybe it's just really badly designed. I suspect the latter.

Okay interesting, because I can assure you, I had a 1978 Suzuki GS550 impossible to put on the stand, then my Africa twin, I could do it once without luggage and I was rinsed, couldn't do it twice in a row !
Yet the Tiger to me is hassle free, but maybe it's the Africa twin training that gave me the "technique", so to me it's fine because I manage it 3 or 4 times even with cases on no problem, I really have seen people do it wrong, I used to do it wrong before my mecanic showed me on the Africa twin as well  :435:.
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: StretchToo on October 21, 2019, 12:19:43 PM
Some of the centre stands seem to be just a bit "off", maybe the profile of the feet, and this make the bike very hard to lift. Mine is one, I'm 6'3" and 13st10, spend my time not biking cycling, running and climbing. If I find it hard most other people will. My friend's bike just pops on it's stand. Yes there's the good technique that makes it possible. This is still the hardest bike I've had to put up on the stand.

Some of the people (thankfully not on this thread) with the good stands will tell you it's no problem, you're a big softy and it's no different from any other bike. These folks need to understand that one thing welded up from bits of metal tube can be different from another, even when it has the same part number.
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: Djairouks on October 21, 2019, 12:32:03 PM
*Originally Posted by StretchToo [+]
Some of the centre stands seem to be just a bit "off", maybe the profile of the feet, and this make the bike very hard to lift. Mine is one, I'm 6'3" and 13st10, spend my time not biking cycling, running and climbing. If I find it hard most other people will. My friend's bike just pops on it's stand. Yes there's the good technique that makes it possible. This is still the hardest bike I've had to put up on the stand.

Some of the people (thankfully not on this thread) with the good stands will tell you it's no problem, you're a big softy and it's no different from any other bike. These folks need to understand that one thing welded up from bits of metal tube can be different from another, even when it has the same part number.

Fair enough that explanation makes sense, even if it's disappointing they wouldn't be so precise on center stands, especially after I looked at the SW motech site and their stands are apparently different, they have different ones for different models through the years, so maybe these are more functional !
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: Dilbert on October 21, 2019, 01:03:18 PM
I found my old 2011 T800 difficult to put onto the centre stand and totally impossible with the panniers on, not because of the weight, but the access and foot lever placement, I've not had a centre stand on many bikes since the 80's (took it off the old T800) and have got used to using a paddock stand for maintenance and repairs. I didn't get one for the new one, just some paddock stand bobbins  :001:

I couldn't get my Explorer onto it's centre stand for about 18 months, but that was more due to poor technique and a wonky right leg, it was a sign that my leg was finally structurally sound that when I tried for the 4th or 5th time it just popped straight up there, my tyre fitter, who's a fairly short guy can pop any bike (including my Explorer) up on the centre stand, as can the shorter service guys, it's definitely nothing to do with size, or weight of the operator, though obviously I doubt Arnie would have any problem  :008:
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: csg1998 on October 21, 2019, 02:30:34 PM
Might be teaching you to suck eggs here, but I always struggled with bike centre stands until one day someone showed me the correct technique.  In my head, I was trying to pull the bike backwards onto the stand, when you should just be pulling the bike upwards, if that makes sense.   Sounds obvious, but it's a subtle difference of technique that makes all the difference, to me at least.
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: applecorp on October 21, 2019, 02:34:49 PM
Yeah the technique is to press straight down with the foot and straight up with your arms, right hand preferably grabbing at a lower point such as by the rear pegs rather than the grab rail.
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: StretchToo on October 21, 2019, 03:14:44 PM
Yes, exactly, and if you have one of the iffy centre stands put your right foot on the stand lever, grab by the rear footpeg and put ALL your weight on that lever, take your left foot off the floor, and pull up with all your might. It'll go up and land with a bang. A good one is a much gentler transfer of weight and lands with a clunk.
Title: Re: Centre stand
Post by: Djairouks on October 21, 2019, 06:12:50 PM
*Originally Posted by StretchToo [+]
Yes, exactly, and if you have one of the iffy centre stands put your right foot on the stand lever, grab by the rear footpeg and put ALL your weight on that lever, take your left foot off the floor, and pull up with all your might. It'll go up and land with a bang. A good one is a much gentler transfer of weight and lands with a clunk.

As I have the aluminum panniers, grabbing on the panniers frame made it Indeed even easier !